Angie 00:00 Good Monday morning, everyone, and welcome to No More Mondays podcast. As always, I am your host, Angie Callen, here to help you kick off the week with inspiration to live and work more authentically. Today we’re going to take a little bit of a different approach. I often say that successful entrepreneurship is 80% mindset — so we’re going to go there. We’re going to dive deep into the mental fortitude it takes to build and sustain a business. Enter Justin Schenck. I’m fairly certain we were separated at birth and placed on opposite sides of Pennsylvania, which is one of the reasons we clicked immediately upon a 22-second introduction at an event a few months ago. He’s an entrepreneur, speaker, and podcast host of the top-rated show Growth Now Movement. Most importantly, he is a good human helping other good humans make impact in this world. Justin, welcome to No More Mondays.

Justin 00:52 Angie, thanks for having me. I’m excited.

Angie 00:55 Me too. We were in the green room before we came online laughing about how we’ve seen each other on Zoom more than any other single human over the past month. It’ll be fun to just continue this conversation.

Justin 01:05 Yeah, I’m excited. We just had you on my show, and our episodes might actually come out the same week — so it’ll be like a trade off. Everyone will go listen to my episode, everybody will come listen to your episode. And then we can have them rate us one through five on who did better.

Angie 01:18 Oh okay — so we just turned this into both a takeover and a competition at the same time. Good point to say: go Eagles.

Justin 01:25 Yeah, go Birds. We had a win back in 2018 which still felt fresh, at least for Philadelphia — because we like taking a really long time between wins. It was amazing. I did not expect a blowout, that’s for sure.

Angie 01:36 I kind of did. I grew up in Pittsburgh — Steelers fans are notorious for knowing the game very well. Also a Pirates fan, speaking of droughts. I’m a huge fan of Jalen Hurts and I love Saquon Barkley. I was rooting for the Birds, and as a team they’ve got great messages that totally tie into what we do in business. I love the inspiration they’re putting out in the world.

Justin 01:55 It’s been a really fun team to watch. The record-breaking season for Saquon is hilarious — we all hated Saquon for years because he was a Giant, but now we’re all gigantic fans of the man, and he seems happier than ever in Philadelphia.

Angie 02:08 Fair weather fans. Now — on to entrepreneurship. As Justin mentioned, I was on his show, so we’re going to jump past the “we both hit rock bottom and somehow built a successful business from the depths of despair” conversation. If you want to hear it, go listen to my conversation on Growth Now Movement podcast — it’s there. This will be the continuation. Knowing we both came from that place, I want to get into your head. What were you thinking and telling yourself at that initial point of struggle, when you were in that low place trying to figure out what was coming next?

Justin 02:42 It’s interesting, because there were a couple of rock bottom moments. Trying to get the business off the ground, being broke, getting fired from my day job. Then COVID hit and I lost 75% of my income after I’d already built something, and went — what do I do? The reality is, part of me was too naive not to just make it work. It was almost like: okay, this is just another thing that’s happening. How do I put together different pieces? And it goes back to — I was poor before, I could be poor again. When I was a kid, I watched my mom’s car get repossessed. I grew up poor. Now that I have money, I go: well, I could be poor again. If you can accept that all-or-nothing thinking — if you accept the possibility of nothing — it’s a lot easier to take steps forward.

Angie 03:25 That’s fascinating — I almost want you to talk more about that. I think we live a little too much in the “it’s all” category and we’re never willing to entertain that there could be nothing, and that most likely it’s somewhere in the middle. Tell me more.

Justin 03:40 Nothing is very fresh in my mind. I’ve experienced it many times in my life and I know it’s a possibility again. What I don’t think is a possibility again is being fully employed by a company, because I’ve figured out different ways to make it work. The one thing I always did when my back was against the wall was invest in myself financially in order to move forward. And this is the piece most people miss. They go: once I get the money, then I’ll invest in myself. Once I get to a certain place, then I can get a coach or join a mastermind. When I was starting out, I had the opportunity to speak at an event in Orlando. This was before I got paid to speak, and I’d just gotten fired from my day job. It literally came down to: do I go speak at this event, or do I pay my rent? I made the smart decision and went to the event — I’ll figure out the rent later. Getting in that room changed my life. I sat next to Mike Kim, and we had an in-depth conversation about how to handle my business. At the time I owned a podcast production company, and he said: you’re literally racing people to go broke, because everybody’s undercutting everybody to be the cheapest. But you’re the only one doing it who was chosen by Inc Magazine as a top-rated podcaster. You need to get paid for that. I went home and made $22,000 in three weeks and never looked back. Looking at things differently is impossible unless people are helping you look at things differently. Then in 2020, when I lost 75% of my income, I hired a coach for $15,000 I didn’t have — to completely change how my business works. I didn’t know how to build an online course, but I did it. Shifted things virtually, did a number of virtual events, shifted into this new world of: wait, my podcast is online, so my business could also be online. I started making money in different avenues, and realized again — if I didn’t invest in myself when my back was against the wall, I would have nothing. Might as well invest and move forward faster by having the right people around you.

Angie 05:20 If you want to know the entrepreneurial spirit is alive and well — look at someone who chooses going to an event over eating. Just going to leave that there.

Justin 05:28 Well, the good news is they gave you lunch at the event, so I did have some food.

Angie 05:32 Two birds, one stone. There’s a piece in here I particularly love, because I think in the entrepreneurial space — especially when we’re new in business — we tend to go it alone too much. Either because we think we have to, or we think we can’t afford not to. And in your case, investing in yourself was literally the difference.

Justin 05:52 It made a world of difference. There’s an African proverb: if you want to go fast, go alone. If you want to go far, go together. I didn’t need overnight massive success — I wanted to build this for the long term. So I had to surround myself with the right people and invest in myself. I’ve had coaches in every area of my life — spirituality, relationships, health, even an author coach recently — all in order to get better at things I’m not good at. And you know, we don’t know when this is all going to end, so might as well enjoy the process, even when your back is against the wall. A lot of people who aren’t ready to surround themselves with the right people or get a coach — I think early on it’s ego. So many people are faking it till they make it. They’re broke entrepreneurs who claim to have seven-figure businesses but are actually too broke to invest in themselves. I was the opposite. I was like: I’m really dumb, I don’t know what I’m doing, please help me. A lot of my success in life is because I stood on the shoulders of giants and learned from the right people. I became really resourceful.

Angie 07:00 And there’s a humbleness there — saying I know I don’t know how to do this. It’s important to keep that throughout your entrepreneurial journey, because even if ego didn’t exist at the beginning, it’s going to come in at some point. And you’ll say: I don’t need anybody looking behind my curtain. But that’s actually to your detriment.

Justin 07:18 Yeah, it happens all the time. When I was first starting out, I didn’t realize the power of asking. That Mike Kim moment was like — I’m never missing that opportunity again. I really focus on building relationships. People ask me: how do you become friends with these big names you’ve had on your podcast? I say: I don’t expect anything from them. I give as much as I can and I keep showing up for them. Then relationships happen. My rolodex is ridiculous because I focus on giving and building relationships for the long term. People are too short-sighted in business. They get in a room with somebody with a billion dollars and go: how do I get some of that money? Versus: how do I help them make a bigger impact in the world? At that level, if you have billions of dollars, making more money isn’t the goal. How can I support you in that process? If you look at it long-term and build those relationships, the success happens on the back end.

Angie 08:10 Put away all need for instant gratification. It runs rampant in today’s society and will not serve you as an entrepreneur. If you’re sitting at a table with a brilliant businessperson asking how to get some of their money, you’re losing out on their wisdom — which is worth infinitely more than any pennies they’d give you. And thinking long-term as an entrepreneur is so important, because entrepreneurship is not linear. There are ups and downs — I call that the entrepreneurial mind-bleep. There’s this baseline of equilibrium you have to find throughout the highs and lows that keeps your eye on the long haul. Because if you’re riding the roller coaster of “I got a deposit today” versus “I haven’t gotten money in three days,” you’re going to throw up on it or get off at the first stop. How do you establish that baseline for yourself? What does it look like in your head?

Justin 09:10 When we talk about highs and lows in business, we think about money — that’s probably the number one thing. But money is not a driving factor for me. If I have a ton in the bank, I feel fine. If I don’t have a ton, I feel fine — it doesn’t affect me either way. And entrepreneur money is different than paycheck money. When I was an employee I spent everything that came in because I knew another check was coming in two weeks. Versus when you’re an entrepreneur, you have to manage your cash differently and pay taxes at year end instead of getting money back. So I look at it as: keep your nose down and stay focused on your purpose. If you’re focused on your purpose, the rest takes care of itself. When things don’t seem to be going right, people get so worried and go into that negative mindset — everything’s falling apart, nobody’s gonna pay me, I don’t know how I’m gonna pay rent. Guess what — you’re gonna live there, if that’s what you’re thinking. Versus: who can I impact today? How can I help somebody get what they need? There’s a quote — I mess up all quotes, but it’s something like: if you want to make more money, help more people get what they want. If you can stay in that mindset, you will be taken care of.

Angie 10:15 There is scientific proof about the impact of positive thinking and abundance versus scarcity mindset. And that idea that everything shrinks or expands to fit the container — if you focus on a way to serve others, the money will come. I want to understand a little more about purpose. You brought up your why, which I’m so excited about. What is your why, how did you find it, and how have you seen it serve you and impact others?

Justin 10:42 My why is that I want people to look at me and say: okay, if he can do it, I can too. From the perspective that it doesn’t matter where you come from — what matters are the choices you make today to make a better tomorrow for yourself and the world. The vision is that it’s bigger than you. You are not the reason you’re building what you’re building — it’s so much bigger than you. My show is called the Growth Now Movement because it’s about creating a movement of people that can make a difference in their lives and the lives around them. This purpose came from a specific moment. Six months before I launched my show, my mom lost a 20-year battle to opioids, and it really began a rock bottom moment for me that lasted quite some time. I ended up going on a three-month bender — blackout drunk six nights a week. I got a call from my coach, and she said: what are you doing tonight? I said I’m going out with some buddies. She said: no you’re not. You’re going to sit and you’re going to feel this. It was the worst night of my life. I did this whole exercise where I wrote a letter to my mom and set it on fire — releasing emotions and allowing myself to feel them for the first time since her passing. When I woke up the next day, I had a number of realizations. First, there was a weight off my shoulders because I’d finally allowed myself to feel. But the first realization was: my mom didn’t die because she was an addict. My mom died because she didn’t love herself. And the second piece was: I didn’t love myself either. And part of loving myself was making sure I was filling my cup first — doing the things to better myself so I can then impact others. That’s really where this purpose came from. It doesn’t matter where you were. It doesn’t matter even where you are today. What matters are the choices you make today to create a better tomorrow for yourself and the people around you. What’s in your cup is for you — whatever flows over is for everybody. Fill the hell out of your cup, because you deserve to have great things. And that doesn’t always mean money. I ask a two-part question on every single episode: what’s your definition of success, and what are three things you do every single day to ensure that success for yourself? The common theme across everyone I’ve interviewed is that those three things always involve taking care of themselves first. The most selfless thing you can do is to be selfish — because if you’re not taken care of, you can’t help others. That was a massive shift for me. Once I flipped the script on that, my business grew, my relationships got better, I found my wife. Everything changed just by focusing on myself first, while still focusing on that purpose and impact.

Angie 13:05 It’s strange — the most selfless thing you can do is prepare yourself to give the world the purpose you’re meant to give it, and you can’t do that if you aren’t strong enough. You just gave a very real-world example of something I tell a lot of people: there is no better exploration into self-discovery than entrepreneurship. It put you in that place to become a more whole person and work through ugly stuff that was going to disrupt your growth potential at some point. What triggered the work is what enables you to go make a difference in others.

Justin 13:40 And I said to myself in that moment: I am no longer going to allow outside circumstances to determine the choices I make on a daily basis. That changed the game for me. On the other end of that spectrum is somebody who hits a rock bottom moment, feels bad for themselves, rebounds a little, then hits the next rock bottom, and the next. Unfortunately for my mom, it was too late. So how can we define our rock bottom moment and not allow it to happen again? I always challenge people from the stage: right now is your rock bottom moment. Don’t allow yourself to ever be fully derailed by outside circumstances again. You can feel emotions — but don’t allow them to change your course and direction. Ed Mylett says it best: life is happening for me, not to me. Even the bad stuff. And if you can have that mindset, it’s rough at first. Well, why did my mom die at 58 after battling opioids for 20 years? Why? The reality is, if that rock bottom moment didn’t happen, I wouldn’t be doing what I’m doing now, and I wouldn’t have impacted millions of lives through my show. I realized pretty early on that this podcast was my vehicle. About 40 something episodes in — nine years ago, when nobody even knew what podcasts were — nobody was listening. About 40 people were downloading the show. Around episode 46 I thought: I’ll hit 52 and I’m done. Then I got a message from somebody in Japan that said: because of your show, I decided not to take my life. And I realized — even if one person is listening, I’m going to show up. I’m going to keep doing this. If you change one life, you change the entire world. So I kept showing up. Now the show plays in 100 countries every single week. It started with that hard moment of: I’m doing all this work and nobody’s listening. I pushed through because of my purpose. And now I get to do live events, speak on stages around the world, and build relationships with some of the coolest people. If I didn’t have my podcast, I wouldn’t know you — and that’s just the reality.

Angie 15:40 One of my favorite things about podcasting is the community it builds. I want to go back, because I’m picking up on an important common theme: we all have a rock bottom we’re meant to be in, because then we understand what a rock looks like versus what rubber is, and it helps us build resilience. A lot of times it helps us identify our real why — a purpose we wouldn’t have been as committed to following had the hardship not given us experience and insight. And those hardships condition us and build the thick skin we need to put that purpose out there and trust it’s impacting people, even when we can’t see it.

Justin 16:18 People reach out to me all the time when they’re going through hard times — I think it’s just part of the brand I’ve built. People feel like I can be a shoulder to lean on, even though I’m a bruiser and I call it like I see it. But I know when not to be that person. When people reach out and say nothing’s going right, everything’s falling apart, my business isn’t doing well, my marriage isn’t good — I literally say to most of them: congratulations, you’re about to have a massive breakthrough. Without the breakdown, there is no breakthrough. I believe it is the universe testing you: do you really want this? This is your test. Push through it. That season may be short or it may be long, but you have to be willing to ride it out, stay focused on the right things, and have that mindset: congratulations, you’re about to have a breakthrough.

Angie 17:05 I completely agree. Whatever your definition of a higher power is — I truly believe we are being prepared to do the thing we’re really meant to do. A lot of what we talk about might sound woo-woo — know your why, know your purpose, rise from rock bottom, become the Phoenix. But we see it time and time again. It’s so common it’s almost become fact. My big message is: I don’t think you can truly live a satisfied, fulfilling, authentic life without discovering what the purpose is. I hope that means you don’t have to hit rock bottom to find it — but you can go seeking, and in seeking you shall find.

Justin 17:42 Yeah. And you have to have a growth mindset in the first place — that’s the piece nobody really talks about. You can’t be cynical and successful. I’ve had a number of people from The Secret on my podcast. Lisa Nichols was a client of mine. These are people who’ve truly put it into practice. But here’s what people don’t see anymore — they’re still using it every single day. Lisa Nichols was overweight, couldn’t find love, and she literally manifested — putting it out into the universe — a man who not only accepted her for who she was but pushed her to be better. She’s now incredibly fit, she’s in a wonderful marriage. That’s using The Secret beyond just money. In my mastermind, we build our life first and then figure out the business second. When someone says their financial goal is a million dollars, I ask: why? Nobody knows. Money is not the driver. I ask: what do you want your day to look like? How many trips do you want to take? What kind of car do you want to drive? What do you actually want? My biggest fun expenditure is cigars — so figure out how many you want to smoke a year, and then you realize the dollar amount isn’t close to a million. You can literally live the life you want at $400,000 a year, work half the time you expected, and have extra trips because you’re not working all the time. Rewire your brain as far as how you set goals, and then the action becomes so much more exciting. One of my daily non-negotiables is a five to ten-minute visualization practice. Right now it’s about my live event — what do I want it to look like, sound like, smell like, feel like. That makes it easier to do the hard things, like sliding into someone’s inbox and asking if they got their ticket yet. Vision the feeling — even if you’ve never seen a million dollars in your bank account, you know what it feels like when loved ones celebrate your big wins. You know what it feels like to go on vacation somewhere you love. Vision that, and the action becomes a lot easier.

Angie 19:45 You have to know what you want the money to do — versus just an arbitrary number that sounds good because society says it’s cool to be a millionaire. Does it actually align with your values and your purpose? And very practically, I’ve found whether it’s a career or a business — our actual need is typically way lower than we assume once you reverse-engineer the lifestyle you want to support. And for those of you listening, Justin just said — without me prompting him — design your life first, then layer the career on top. I have talked about that for years. I am so refreshingly encouraged any time I meet someone with that same perspective. We accept circumstances too much without ever asking: is this working for me? Is this intentional?

Justin 20:30 And I’ll say this — I don’t do seven figures every year, and I don’t want to, if it means I have to work more. I’m literally living my perfect life. I work two to three hours a day. I can afford everything I want. We take five to seven vacations a year — life is good. I’ve got a great wife, two stepkids, I love my life. I don’t want to spend it in my office. Sometimes we have to check our values before we set goals. Society says you should have a seven-figure business — I don’t care. I want to live the life I want to live and then figure out the rest. That’s the true beauty of entrepreneurship that most people don’t talk about, because you get so caught up in this idea that you need to be working all the time. It’s just not true.

Angie 21:15 It does become a little bit of entrepreneurial martyrdom syndrome. And the other thing — there’s a season for the grind. You did put in the work for several years to build the thing that then aligned with the life. There are seasons. But if you know what you’re working toward and why, it’s easier to identify when you get there. Let me flip the script on you: what is your definition of success, and what are three things you do daily to take care of yourself?

Justin 21:42 My definition of success is to do what I want, when I want, with whom I want. That sounds arbitrary, but it means you’ve built the life you want, surrounded by the people you want, doing everything you want. I actually have four non-negotiables every day. First: I move my body in some way, shape, or form. This morning I walked two miles — it all depends on what the day looks like, but I move. Second: I learn something new every single day — whether that’s reading a book, listening to a podcast, watching a YouTube video. I believe what’s not growing is dead. Third: a visualization practice. You need to know where you’re going. There’s a powerful tool where you can use AI to get really clear on your long-term vision — if you struggle to visualize, use AI as a tool for that. And fourth: I reach out to somebody I care about every single day just to check on them. A simple text — hey, I know you’re going through this, I hope you’re alright. That’s a huge, powerful thing. And rarely is there a day that goes by now — because I’ve been doing it so long — that somebody doesn’t check on me in return. It’s become this really cool thing. Every time I tell somebody about it, they say they’re going to start doing it too. Those are my four non-negotiables.

Angie 23:00 I particularly love the fourth one. My three non-negotiables are very similar — move, eat good food, and connect with people, because I’m super extroverted. And I feel like we’re at a real shift in society. Because of the increasing disconnection — with the illusion of connectedness — real, authentic relationships and purpose are going to be a secret weapon.

Justin 23:22 It’s true. With AI and everything being created at the click of a button, content creation is so overdone now. What’s going to make things more human? It’s live events, speaking on stages, attending gatherings in person — those are going to make a difference for business owners. I use AI to write my emails, because I have so much content out on the internet that I can say “write this in Justin Schenck’s voice” and it sounds exactly like me. But when you’re talking to somebody on a podcast, creating long-form content, or speaking on stage in person — that’s what’s going to set you apart. And to speak to people who are overwhelmed by everything happening in the world: turn off your TV. Stop doom-scrolling. Go outside in the sun, put your feet in the grass, and realize it’s overhyped. The world you need to control is right in front of you. Worry about your house, worry about your family. Don’t worry about all the noise. I’ve been there — I doom-scrolled and it was awful. Once I got myself out of it, I slept better, had a lot less stress, felt really good. Check on the ones you care about. Turn off the damn phone.

Angie 24:30 Control what you can control — that’s my mantra, and what I’m really encouraging others right now. Years ago I read Eat That Frog and Brian Tracy says: do not consume news, it’s a waste of time. I’ve been in that habit of consuming very little. But it’s easy to fall back into doom-scrolling when everything feels hyper-realistic. Disconnect and reconnect. And speaking of live events — you just perfectly cued up a little something happening outside of Philadelphia in a few weeks.

Justin 24:58 Yes. I’ll tell the backstory of where Growth Now Summit Live came from. I started building success with the podcast — I got on Inc Magazine’s list of top eight podcasts, which got me opportunities and an audience. I was sitting down with people like Ed Mylett, Gabby Bernstein, Fabio Viviani, Bert Kreischer. And I thought: how do I bring what I get to do every day to other people? Growth Now Summit Live was born from the idea of — yes, incredible speakers, but there is no red velvet rope. You are literally just in the room with them. They are you, you are them. It’s become an amazing thing to see all the connection happen. What I’ve realized this time around is that so many previous guests and keynote speakers are actually buying tickets and coming back to attend as participants — this room is going to be the most stacked room of driven thought leaders and motivated people. And you’re not going to remember 10% of what’s said on stage. We’re going to make sure we entertain you and you learn things, but what’s lasting is the relationships built. There are people who met at my event in 2019 who are still friends, who have businesses together. It’s all about showing up, shaking hands, making relationships happen. The main event is April 4 in Westchester, Pennsylvania — keynote speakers, sit-down conversations, panels, subject matter experts, and a ton of fun. If people are interested, go to growthnowsummit.com. Come hang out, come give us a hug — Angie’s going to be there. People ask me all the time: how do I get on your podcast? How do I get on your stage? I say: show up and come on the journey with me, and it’ll happen.

Angie 26:40 For all my Pittsburgh friends — head on over to the turnpike on April 4 and come see us in person. You want to be in the room where it happens.

Justin 26:50 I know it’s a dreadful drive down the turnpike — the most boring four hours of your life — but it’ll be worth it. Shout out to Pittsburgh: one of the most underrated cities in the country. I said this one of the first times we talked — they always say Philly is the City of Brotherly Love, but I believe Pittsburgh is the friendliest city in Pennsylvania without a doubt.

Angie 27:08 Why not? I’m going back east for it and it’s always fun to reconnect with Pennsylvania roots. This has been an awesome conversation. We’ll link the event information in the show notes — you’re going to want to be there. As we wind things down and as we talk about relationships — I’ve been fortunate to build some really amazing virtual relationships, but there’s nothing quite like when they turn into IRL.

Justin 27:28 There you go. I love it. Angie, this has been great — thank you so much for having me.

Angie 27:33 Justin, thank you so much for joining me today and sharing your wisdom and your story. It’s so important that people hear that you can overcome circumstances and make your mess your message. Success is never about money — it’s making a difference in your life so you can impact the lives of others. It’s just that simple. Justin Schenck, thank you again for joining me on No More Mondays. And for all of you out there listening — thank you for spending time with us today. I’ll see you next week for another episode of No More Mondays.